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A.O. Kime Articles:

AGRICULTURE
Betrayal
Biocontrols
Bio-oddity #1
Bio-oddity #2
CECA
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Family farms
Farm facts
Farm socialism
Kansas Settlement
Kime ordeal
Mission creep
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ANTIQUITY
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METAPHYSICAL
Afterlife
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Empowering God
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Ethics
Evil (nature of)
Gift of life
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Inkwell philosophy
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Matrix (real)
Melissos
Metaphysical poetry
Metaphysics
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Muse
Plotinus
Polytheism
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Sixth sense
Spiritual soul
Spirit world
Subconscious mind
Suicide
Superhumanness
Time (nature of)
Two Septembers
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SOCIOPOLITICAL
19th century
Arrogance
Civil wars
Civilization
Coolness
Curse of science
Economic injustices
Establishment
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Grand Jury
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Majority rule
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Politesse
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Proposition 203
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War contradictions
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Afterlife Dreaming, Immortality and Concept of Time

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Comparing a 'dream-state afterlife' to the common concept of immortality in heaven

(4th edition - October 2012) by A.O. Kime
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Memories, dreams and forever

While thoughts and images stored in our memory banks seem to be the stuff dreams are made of - plus the fact the human brain couldn’t function without memory - there may be yet another function which memory serves. Memories may constitute entirely our existence in the hereafter.

The idea of an eternal dream state following death isn't new however... its simplistic nature suggests it originated in antiquity long before the concepts of reincarnation or immortality in 'heaven'. While a far less common belief today, albeit persistent, it deserves further consideration. After all, the lingering uncertainties about the popular beliefs today (heaven / reincarnation) seem to haunt mankind interminably. Uncertainties and doubts make one apprehensive... beliefs should 'square' people think. At least make some sense.

Yet, to investigate this, can logic serve us at all? Is it even possible to determine which scenario is more likely? Well, perhaps in trying to imagine the problems the creator might encounter - or the trouble he'd have to go to - would yield some clues.

Flesh & blood immortality

While the creator is surely capable of producing a body (or rejuvenating the same) for the purpose of granting an immortal presence in 'heaven' if he wanted... but it would seem a complex undertaking if that were the case. Of a process wholly unimaginable, we might only presume cell reproduction would somehow be altered whereby a human body wouldn’t age. Or, possibly, it could be a case immortals aren’t comprised of flesh and blood… but instead being of a composition totally alien to us.

While flesh and blood is what we commonly think of which can support life, we tend to forget trees and plants are living creatures too. This huge difference suggests types of life can vary widely. Who knows… in allowing for the allegorical nature of Greek mythology perhaps the titans were of a different sort.

Still, it doesn't seem 'natural'... being out of character for 'passiveness' (a characteristic of the spirit world).

Memories and free will

If immortality (an afterlife) is possible in some manner… then what happens to our earthly memory? After death, will our memory banks be wiped clean? If they are… then what about all we’ve learned? If we don’t retain our memory, aren’t we just as likely to repeat the same mistakes? Surely we would be given ‘free will’… without free will, immortality wouldn’t seem worth having.

At any rate, a retained memory would seem to pose a lesser problem (for God) than an erased memory. There could be all sorts of hazards from an erased memory, we’d be virtually an infant all over again and therefore a retained memory would seem best for this belief (heaven). Yet, there is often pain associated with memory. Would a new environment cause this pain to disappear… at least eventually? Perhaps existing in such a completely different environment hurtful memories could easily be forgotten. After all, one dimension tends to make largely irrelevant the others so the time and space differentials would likely help.

While pondering such questions wouldn't rule out the possibility of immortality in heaven, but they do illustrate the problematic nature of this belief. It reflects a process more complex than seemingly necessary.

Fathoming the depths

So, in trying to make sense of it all, how much has been (or can be) overlooked? Assuredly a lot. Due to the alien nature of etherealness - its bizarre realities - it usually equates to shallow and mistaken observations. Of course, one can continue trying fruitlessly along logical lines or else grasp its true essence by tapping divine intelligence. While nothing is spelled out as a result, knowing its logical disposition is a tremendous aid.

So too, whether or not there is a heaven would determine entirely whether or not there can be immortal beings in physical form. If there is no heaven, then there can be no physical presence (or so it seems). However, a planet similar to earth could be considered heaven… couldn’t it? After all, earth is a heavenly place in many respects. Another earth, or earth itself, could serve nicely as heaven… once rid of the evil and treachery.

Irregardless, it's still problematic.

Even though heaven can’t be disproved, but in assuming it doesn't exist for the reason it is seemingly 'unnatural' - requiring 'hands-on' management in several ways - that doesn't rule out the possibility of an immortal presence in some other manner.

Whichever way the afterlife manifests itself, the immortal aspect of it isn't hard to fathom however. In the spirit world, immortality goes with the territory… death is only a material (physical) event. So it isn’t a matter of being ‘granted’ immortality, immortality is the reality in the spirit world. Since death makes no sense except to serve the interests of a physical reality, the spirit world is a 'deathless society'. Whether or not one survives the transformation from here to there is another matter.

The dream state

Considering all we can within these points, wouldn’t a dream state be more logical? After all, a dream state would save God a lot of trouble from a logistical point of view. And, it could still fulfill the biblical prophesy ‘as ye sow, so shall ye reap’.

In a dream state our image data banks could forever create the scenarios. After all, feeding off of multi-gigabits of stored imagery the possibilities are endless. As a possible clue the dream state is in the running, dreaming has 'spiritual properties'. It seems then dreaming would be a natural feature of the spirit world just as much as immortality.

With dreams having a direct hard-wired connection to our subconscious mind (memories) - and with both having ethereal properties(spiritual) - seems to indicate we're already connected to this 'other world'... even though we're still alive. It's as if the dream state was intended to serve as a 'preview' while at the same time making known the existence of this another dimension. If not for dreaming, the spirit world would be even further removed. It would likely go completely unnoticed or unimaginable.

Language of the spirit world

In considering all of this one must take into account the 'language factor'. After all, invariably we think in 'words'. While most all words within mankind’s various languages differ, whether in spelling, pronunciation or the alphabet, almost invariably they mean the same things. Each language has a word for ‘water’ for example. Only rarely does a language contain a phrase which expresses something in a more descriptive way. When such a phrase is discovered, often its usage is adopted by other languages. Latin and French terms, for example, are often adopted. Déjà vu is one such French phrase which is often used to briefly convey to others this odd phenomenon.

The language of the spirit world is vastly different however. There is a reason… its realities are vastly different which, in turn, causes the corresponding logic to be vastly different. For example, if some apparition of the spirit world was so inclined, it could probably convey the thought meaning ‘water’ or 'rock' whereby we would understand. However, a person, place or thing are physical nouns, something we can easily relate to. The almost incomprehensible part of this alien language would be qualities, ideas and actions... that type of nouns. In addition, it would take a lot of imagination to convert anything into our idea of verbs and adjectives.

These great differences explains the difficulty in accurately characterizing spirit world phenomena. It's why the Bible and Greek mythology often had to resort to allegories. It's also the reason mankind gets nowhere with his metaphysical theories... but to some extent due to the shortcomings of metaphysical semantics (the lack of characterizing terms).

So, to briefly summarize, human logic would likely not interpret the ethereal realities correctly, Not in the same way as an entity from the spirit world would characterize them. Although, in part, it's also because the format of its 'language' is different (it isn't a language of 'words'). So, for all the reasons stated, invariably our understandings would fall short or wouldn't jive. However, there are a few mutual understandings which would agree. For example, ‘purpose’... obvious from any point of view. But, in all, there are probably only two or three dozen words. With a little latitude maybe a hundred.

For an example of a word that wouldn't be applicable, 'when' comes to mind.

Spirit world logic

So, as for the hereafter, is a dream-state the case then? Well, in order for someone to determine (verify) this they must first learn their language… knowing just one word (purpose) isn’t enough. Yet, it isn’t a written or spoken language whereby a dictionary could be developed. It is more of an ‘understanding’ language similar to how eyes and body postures can send messages. Our senses of taste and smell uses this language exclusively as does hearing when it comes to sounds. Only when the day comes we can adequately express (in words) sensory feelings might a dictionary be possible. As it is, the smell of a baking cake and the sound of a saxophone remain indescribable.

Even ‘good’ and ‘evil’ would probably be understood differently… although surely having some similarities. Yet, we can’t assume that either… the dreadful acts of Mother Nature throws a monkey wrench into that logic. Perhaps the spirit world and Mother Nature are not of the same broth however… at least not entirely.

The word ‘commitment’ should be close to having the same meaning and likewise ‘eternity’. But wait… eternity has to do with time and therefore fraught with possibilities. We therefore may not understand what immortality entails. Perhaps the ‘instance of life’ (the dynamics of 'now') comes into play. In other words, life only exists in the ‘now’. One second ago, you are no longer alive… nor are you alive yet tomorrow.

Life as we know it is an aberration within the physical world. Life is actually an injected element with a lifespan of a millisecond. If that wasn’t true, then people would still be experiencing five minutes ago, an hour ago and last week. This, of course, would cause chaos. Since life is not a fixture of the physical - yet it exists in the physical - it has to be an injected element… an element with a lifespan of a millisecond.

Life, immortality and time

Lay hidden, however, are the deeper realities. We don’t know, for example, the relationship between time (this millisecond) and life itself… and surely there is a relationship. Since our concept of time is merely linear, the matter can only be explained thusly… life only exists from one millisecond to the next, it cannot endure any longer. While this doesn’t change what immortality means to us, it probably changes what it is.

Memories, on the other hand, are the results of life retained. So, from the 'linear' perspective it is the baggage we carry from one millisecond to the next. This baggage would also include happiness, sadness and illnesses... except, it's only the memories of them carried forward. While they may linger and continue to have an effect, they only exist in the 'now'. Only the physical impacts of one's existence are long-lasting (like illnesses) but only because they are physically related and can accommodate the linear reality.

It should be noted that the influence from having clocks and calendars has the effect of further distancing us from the reality of time.

Since man’s concept of time cannot accommodate ‘no beginning’ (the reality) would indicate a problem with linear thinking. It's only good for relative matters. However, it's just one small indication the concept is wrong, the others just haven’t revealed themselves yet. Time seems more than just a 'yardstick'... it's more likely a 'metabolism'.

So… are we to forever jump from one millisecond to the next or does immortality entail something entirely different? Perhaps within the spirit world, jumping is not necessary. After all, spirits don’t have to contend with the physical… the physical is where life only exists one millisecond at a time.

Adventurous dreams and vividness

Don't forget to read the amazing article
"The sun... is it alive or not?" and if you
like poetry see "metaphysical poetry" and/or "poetry a la mode" (yes, right here on the world's 1st and only 'reality plus' website)

Although it seems evident dreaming exists in another dimension and while the' afterlife dimension of dreaming is likely similar, it surely has some differences. For example, the harvesting of memories may become a very active pursuit. One might be able to re-live their favorite experiences or have adventurous dreams at will. The vividness should not be in doubt either. While we often associate dreams with a fuzzy picture show, or haphazardness, we tend to forget those occasional eye-openers.

So, it seems, a dream state is more likely the case. We shouldn’t feel cheated though; it could be just as rewarding… perhaps even more thrilling (without the threat of being injured or killed). We rarely know when a dream is a dream anyway.

A.O. Kime

Matrix of Mnemosyne... the place of smoke signals from the spirit world

Last modified: 03/05/16